@steevbishop Well done you. And The Red Lion is indeed a lovely pub, even when full of rowdies! in reply to steevbishop # Jesus, you buy ONE THING at Ann Summers, and you get surreally not-quite-soft-porny advertising e-mails for the rest of your life… # @thoughtmecca Heh, yeah, sorry, I don’t know if I really …
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Found Objects
We need comics. We don’t need the comic mainstream – certainly not as much as it needs us. And we wouldn’t even be having this argument about Watchmen if that book wasn’t part of that industry. It couldn’t have existed without it, it wouldn’t have been relevant without it, and most of us wouldn’t have even had the chance to read it without it.
We don’t have to give a shit about Watchmen, or Before Watchmen. We choose to.
We don’t have to fight about issues that we really have no skin in. We choose to.
We should really grow out of it.
Last Friday I wrote a really long post over at my site about Before Watchmen. It was probably too long, fence-sitting and unstructured to get as much widespread attention as some of the more aggressive pieces out there, but I still feel everything in it.
This is the tiniest part of it - a sentiment that I feel is pretty important - you can read the whole thing here.
I AM IN CONTROL OF MY EMOTIONS!
The Newly Announced Before Watchmen Is a Prime Example of What's Killing Mainstream Comics
“I have no idea whether this project will be any good or not. But it sits as a shining example of the fundamental flaw that exists in the comic industry, especially within DC Comics. They spend most of their time chasing the readers that grew up with their iconic characters rather than attempting to attract new readers who are growing up right now.”
Totally agree with this - though I think DC52, being a company-wide initiative, was more indicative of it, and I said as much at the time.
However, that backward looking trait in comics isn’t unique to publishers. Comic readers - many of whom are also comic retailers, which is a bigger issue - run wild with entitlement on either side of any comic-related debate, and stand ready to jump on anything that they perceive as a deviation or affront to comic texts or characters that they feel shouldn’t be touched. It all adds to the stupidly binary way any comic-related issue is handled.
The huge amount of brilliant work that goes un-discussed, unsupported and unbought in-between those two dominant cultures is the only genuine ongoing tragedy in comics today, I reckon. The rest is just semantics and negotiation of contracts.
Yup, yup, yup…the fact that people are wasting their time arguing about the merits of Before Watchmen while amazing books like The Interactives go largely ignored is, quite frankly, criminal.
Not least because it means that yet again we’re all having a conversation about Watchmen. I came to Watchmen a little bit late - like, a year after publication - and loved it at the time. It encouraged me to go on and read so many more other books, to read them critically, and work out why they work and don’t work etc etc etc. But the more people hold it to this impossible standard in such a hyperbolic and aggressive way, the more I find reasons to chip away at it.
If you love Watchmen that much, write about how good Watchmen is in it’s own right. Don’t use it as a stick to bash everything that’s come since. Don’t use it as a way to try and win an argument about whatever your pet comic issue is that week. I think Alan Moore’s biggest issue is that his book isn’t regarded enough in it’s own right, and it’s an important enough work to be handled without gossip-context and all the other bollocks that passes for adults-who-read-comics-talking-about-comics.
Show Alan Moore and Watchmen a bit of respect, and don’t try and impose your fucking context on it. It’s a work of art. It genuinely can’t be ruined by any art that follows, but it can be ruined by every third word spoken about it being bleaty, entitled shite.
Sorry, you said something? The Interactives? What’s that? I have never heard of it, therefore it must not be worth bothering with.
Yep, I completely agree with you here. As great as Watchmen was it has been a big part of what has utterly ruined comics (and I know that Moore agrees with this himself) as so many people have spent the years since using it as a template for what comic should be. It was a work of satire! It was never intended to be a “How To” guide for aspiring comic creators.
And The Interactives is this - http://theinteractives.com/
Huh. That looks ace, actually.
The Newly Announced Before Watchmen Is a Prime Example of What's Killing Mainstream Comics
“I have no idea whether this project will be any good or not. But it sits as a shining example of the fundamental flaw that exists in the comic industry, especially within DC Comics. They spend most of their time chasing the readers that grew up with their iconic characters rather than attempting to attract new readers who are growing up right now.”
Totally agree with this - though I think DC52, being a company-wide initiative, was more indicative of it, and I said as much at the time.
However, that backward looking trait in comics isn’t unique to publishers. Comic readers - many of whom are also comic retailers, which is a bigger issue - run wild with entitlement on either side of any comic-related debate, and stand ready to jump on anything that they perceive as a deviation or affront to comic texts or characters that they feel shouldn’t be touched. It all adds to the stupidly binary way any comic-related issue is handled.
The huge amount of brilliant work that goes un-discussed, unsupported and unbought in-between those two dominant cultures is the only genuine ongoing tragedy in comics today, I reckon. The rest is just semantics and negotiation of contracts.
Yup, yup, yup…the fact that people are wasting their time arguing about the merits of Before Watchmen while amazing books like The Interactives go largely ignored is, quite frankly, criminal.
Not least because it means that yet again we’re all having a conversation about Watchmen. I came to Watchmen a little bit late - like, a year after publication - and loved it at the time. It encouraged me to go on and read so many more other books, to read them critically, and work out why they work and don’t work etc etc etc. But the more people hold it to this impossible standard in such a hyperbolic and aggressive way, the more I find reasons to chip away at it.
If you love Watchmen that much, write about how good Watchmen is in it’s own right. Don’t use it as a stick to bash everything that’s come since. Don’t use it as a way to try and win an argument about whatever your pet comic issue is that week. I think Alan Moore’s biggest issue is that his book isn’t regarded enough in it’s own right, and it’s an important enough work to be handled without gossip-context and all the other bollocks that passes for adults-who-read-comics-talking-about-comics.
Show Alan Moore and Watchmen a bit of respect, and don’t try and impose your fucking context on it. It’s a work of art. It genuinely can’t be ruined by any art that follows, but it can be ruined by every third word spoken about it being bleaty, entitled shite.
Sorry, you said something? The Interactives? What’s that? I have never heard of it, therefore it must not be worth bothering with.
The Newly Announced Before Watchmen Is a Prime Example of What's Killing Mainstream Comics
“I have no idea whether this project will be any good or not. But it sits as a shining example of the fundamental flaw that exists in the comic industry, especially within DC Comics. They spend most of their time chasing the readers that grew up with their iconic characters rather than attempting to attract new readers who are growing up right now.”
Totally agree with this - though I think DC52, being a company-wide initiative, was more indicative of it, and I said as much at the time.
However, that backward looking trait in comics isn’t unique to publishers. Comic readers - many of whom are also comic retailers, which is a bigger issue - run wild with entitlement on either side of any comic-related debate, and stand ready to jump on anything that they perceive as a deviation or affront to comic texts or characters that they feel shouldn’t be touched. It all adds to the stupidly binary way any comic-related issue is handled.
The huge amount of brilliant work that goes un-discussed, unsupported and unbought in-between those two dominant cultures is the only genuine ongoing tragedy in comics today, I reckon. The rest is just semantics and negotiation of contracts.
